[OOTB-hive] Wiki updates

Peter Monks peter.monks at alfresco.com
Fri May 22 22:40:24 BST 2015

G’day Martin,

Nowhere did I state or imply that this is an easier path for newcomers - I merely said that the prior approach was likely a significant source of confusion for newcomers.  While I can appreciate the argument that labeling everything as “Obsolete” is equally confusing, ultimately anyone belaboring that point is really just wasting time arguing over two equally unsatisfactory situations.  I assume we agree that a better situation is one where obsolete pages are correctly and comprehensively marked as such, and vice versa?

But what’s happened has happened - we now have an opportunity to take action and move towards a better situation, and in that spirit, I’ve just gone in and “de-obsoleted” a number of pages<https://wiki.alfresco.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/Pmonks> [1] I chose semi-at-random.  It took me approximately 1 minute per page, which should give some indication of the level of effort that’s involved.  If each of us chose to do something similar each day, I think Richard’s plan would come to fruition in short order, benefiting everyone (old times and newcomers) alike.

To get started, you might like to review the manifest of obsolete pages<https://wiki.alfresco.com/index.php?title=Category:Obsolete_Pages> [2]?

“If we could change ourselves, the tendencies in the world would also change. As a man changes his own nature, so does the attitude of the world change towards him. We need not wait to see what others do.”
 - Mahatma Gandhi

[1] https://wiki.alfresco.com/wiki/Special:Contributions/Pmonks
[2] https://wiki.alfresco.com/index.php?title=Category:Obsolete_Pages

On 2015-05-22, at 2:07 PM, Martin Cosgrave <martin at ocretail.com<mailto:martin at ocretail.com>> wrote:

It's much worse now for newcomers, they are being definitively told that good information is bad. I don't know how you can think that that is an easier path for a newbie. It really is vandalism in my opinion.

On 22/05/15 22:00, Peter Monks wrote:
G’day Mark,

The best solution is what Richard said:

“clear that tag on good pages or mark the ones that need work but should be kept.”

This is an exercise virtually everyone in the community can participate in, as it’s both low effort / expertise (was a page useful? remove the tag!) and high value - over the long run it will allow us (the inclusive “us”, not the divisive “us”…) to remove pages that retained the tag - a kind of “Sieve of Esplinosthenes” if you will.  ;-)

And while clearly outdated pages are obvious to longstanding members of the community, I suspect they were (prior to the tag) a significant source of confusion for newcomers who don’t know what they don’t know (yet).


On 2015-05-22, at 12:33 PM, Mark Stang <markjstang at gmail.com<mailto:markjstang at gmail.com>> wrote:

I was a bit shocked to see all the wiki pages marked as Obsolete.  I asked an "Alfresco Insider" who informed me that:

Richard marked every wiki page obsolete. He is hoping people will either clear that tag on good pages or mark the ones that need work but should be kept.

I don't know if the CMIS stuff was moved to docs or not.

Some of it is obviously out-of-date and has been for awhile.  The rest is still current AFAIK.  So, going forward, I am ignoring the warning.

I am not sure what the best solution would be.



On Fri, May 22, 2015 at 1:24 PM, Martin Cosgrave <martin at ocretail.com<mailto:martin at ocretail.com>> wrote:
I've read the whole thread, except I started a few messages in, and the last thing I've done is to come back to the first post and actually look at the chart in question. I actually don't have a problem with it, as has been said you expect marketing types to do that, but at least there at the bottom is a clear download link to CE. I couldn't be more pleased that the two are presented together. I'm sure that everyone must have had experiences similar to mine of knowing that a product has an open source version, and struggling to find any mention of it until you find the tiny 'Community' link in dark brown on black at the bottom of the page.

There is certainly no harm in creating a counterpoint page, it could be quite tongue in cheek, maybe we can put a lot of red X's next to EE :-P

A quick side note about Honeycomb, there really is a lot of good stuff you guys could contribute, especially if you know puppet or a similar devops tool, but if not even just building it and commenting on or modifying the configurations we have chosen would be really useful. There are only two of us involved in it right now and I've been a bit busy starting a job and moving city in the last month or so. I just noticed it was mentioned a couple of times in the thread so I guess there is some value there and mindshare even if nobody's stepping forward.

It's a shame the thread spiralled out of control at the end there. At the beginning it was really constructive and it's definitely worth going back and looking over those bits :-) . However it's obvious there are strong feelings on both sides. Personally I feel very strongly that the vandalism to the wiki pages which marks all the useful community-oriented documentation as obsolete be reverted.

I thought Ainga's point that we could be more marketing oriented as bees was spot on. Perhaps he could step up to the mark on that one, as a bee who is also a CEO?

I like very much Heiko's idea for a common model registry, especially if he has some models to donate to it. What a great thing for OOTB to have, especially as the model system confuses newcomers to the product, both for CE and EE I am sure.

I really wish we could have a documentation project. To my mind there has never been any decent documentation for alfresco, and Jeff's noble efforts, which were amazing, were nonetheless stories about how to do certain tasks, and stories do not make decent documentation. I suppose this is a common conflict for open source companies trying to sell consultancy, or to build a partner ecosystem, if the documentation is too good then there will be no need for consultants.

Anyway, great thread really, I actually think that the getting out of control bit was probably a misunderstanding, at least as far as I can tell re-reading the messages. It's great to know that so many people care about the Order. Hopefully we can see a bit more active participation as a result.

Have a great weekend


On 21/05/15 09:59, Andreas Steffan wrote:
Hallo everybody,

I can't help myself, but the CE looks pretty bad at https://www.alfresco.com/products/community-vs-alfresco-one to me (red all over the place).

Seriously: Imagine you are a somewhat clueless prospect on that page which reads " Ready to get started? Download the edition that is right for you.".

Would you want to give the CE a try?


Andreas Steffan

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